NC 23 starting problem

atheos_mb · Post by **atheos_mb** » Sun Nov 22, 2009 7:44 pm

Hello guys,

I am new to the forum and need advise.I have aquired a cbr nc23 that was sitting in somebodys yard for some years.I tried to start the bike 8 months ago with some servicing I did to it and the bike started.I let it run for a minute and then stopped it due to the gas leakage.

Recently I tried to start it again with no success.It was leaking again and found out it was from the carbs.removed the carbs dissassembled them and cleaned the thouroughly.I did NOT change any screw settings.Now the carbs are back on and still it leaks.Finally they leaked because I shorted out the connection from the relay fuel pump.The relay wasnt working.Now I put on a working relay and it doesnt leak but STILL it doesnt start.Is there a chance the combustion chamber is full with fluid?

The ignition relay/solenoid is ticking,the starter motor is turned and the bike in general sounds healthy but it doesnt fire up

WORK done on the bike before it started for the first time 8 months ago
________________________________________
1.fuses replaced
2.fuel pump relay points where shorted out to give voltage to fuel pump
3.ignition switch 3 points were all shorted between them/ignition switch didnt work at all

bike started

work done now in order to start the bike(it didnt start again)
_____________________________________
replaced fuel pump relay
removed disassembled and cleaned throuroughly the carbs

the bike still sounds healthy but it wont start
1.I didnt place the filter box on the carbs.I dont know if the carbs get more air now and it doesnt start
2.Can it be that the combustion chamber is filled with gasoline?can i drain it somehow?

The carbs were leaking cause I was giving voltage to the fuel pump continuously.If you use the relay then the pump works in pulses

If you can think of anything I should check please tell me

Best regards
atheos_mb

Post by **petrolhead19** » Mon Nov 23, 2009 1:36 am

Sounds very familiar this to something i came across.

if the fuel pump has been running constantly then it will of filled your carbs with petrol, the float boils will of over flooded and just kept filling up and emptying into your piston barrels, your piston will of come up as your tryin to start it and because of the amount of petrol it would of been like hitting a brick wall.

so im guessing it wont even turn over?

if this is the case then take out your spark plugs try start it up with spark plugs out, and if the barrels are full of petrol then it will shoot out of the spark plug holes pretty fast so make sure you start it near a wall and NOT looking down the holes as you do it lol

Hope this helps mate
all the best

atheos_mb · Post by **atheos_mb** » Wed Nov 25, 2009 6:02 pm

At least I was honest

If you dont have the airbox on,the engine cannot make the vacuum/pressure on the carbs in order to mix and feed the engine with gasoline.I have the J model and J&K models need the airbox on to start while the L,N,R models have an electric circuit and thats how its knows how to distribute the petrol

Anyhow the engine almost started,I heard gunshot sounds :) but stopped it cause it was still leaking gas.I could pinpoint the section.either the carburetors or the joint between carburetors and engine intake

Carbs have only one seal where gasoline passes through and thats the float chamber.I didnt notice before but the seal is flat in its groove.In order to seal it it should rise well above it doesnt it?

Thats my question I need your experience.
And just because it might be to difficult to find gasket seals for that type of carbs can I use any compound that is gasoline proof?

Best regards
atheos_mb

Post by **Wozza** » Wed Nov 25, 2009 6:49 pm

atheos_mb wrote:I didnt notice before but the seal is flat in its groove.In order to seal it it should rise well above it doesnt it?

A bit, yes.

Post by **Cammo** » Thu Nov 26, 2009 6:02 am

atheos_mb wrote: Anyhow the engine almost started,I heard gunshot sounds :)

And just because it might be to difficult to find gasket seals for that type of carbs can I use any compound that is gasoline proof?

Gunshot sounds usually = flooded!

Leaking form the float bowls is common, new seals would fix it, but you're correct a petrol resistant gasket goo will do the job. It won't like to start without the airbox on, and might not at all!

atheos_mb · Post by **atheos_mb** » Wed Dec 09, 2009 2:16 pm

By all means gunshots isnt healthy at all,but in my situation before and after gunshot is progress

at least now i know there is fuel flow

carbs fixed with gasoline resistant compound

atheos_mb · Post by **atheos_mb** » Wed Dec 09, 2009 2:59 pm

I dont know if I should start a new topic now.................

Bike now starts.
a ) it revs to 7000 rpm for idle speed.didnt think to check the idle screw
b ) There is fuel coming out of the 1&2 carbs fuel overflow hose.it looks like its the amount of fuel that needs to run both 1&2 cylinders
c ) Bike doesnt sound that is running smooth
d ) Exhaust has a lot of smoke comming out.YES it should have fumes comming out but not that much
e ) Engine smokes as well and emmits a lot of heat but the temp is normal.

Dont answer me on (a) and (e) yet cause I have to check the idle screw and I did spray the whole bike with diesel and lub oil to prevent further corrosion from the previous owner,but that was 9 months ago.

The second sentence on (d) is to answer in advance on those who will tease me

I might have mismatched the ignition coil leads,searched the haynes manual but I need a lot of effort to find my way from the ingition coil to the lead.Is there a hint on those?

Thank you in advance

Post by **Davez29** » Wed Dec 09, 2009 3:14 pm

atheos_mb wrote: I might have mismatched the ignition coil leads,searched the haynes manual but I need a lot of effort to find my way from the ingition coil to the lead.Is there a hint on those?

would this page help?

http://www.cmsnl.com/honda-cbr400rrj-nc ... F27-1.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

atheos_mb · Post by **atheos_mb** » Wed Dec 09, 2009 6:06 pm

I already found the match for the leads.its stated on the wires but thanx

Now that i know this link its a good time to copy the image

atheos_mb · Post by **atheos_mb** » Wed Dec 09, 2009 6:27 pm

Update on the problem...

1 )
As said before the engine now runs but it looks like only cylinders 3&4 work.On 1&2 nothing happens.There is a lot of temperature difference in the exhaust pipes.1&2 do heat up but I guess only because they as connected to the engine.
2 )
I have been able to start the engine without the airbox on although at the beginning of this post I insisted this is not possible.I blocked the vacuum hose that comes out on top of the cylinder heads and connects on to the airbox and the engine starts.With the engine running carbs 3&4 produce vacuum while 1&2 the produce minimal.Either blocked or freed the 1&2 air intake,the engine produces the same sound.When I do the same thing to 3&4 the sound changes.
3 )
I have taken off the carbs to open them up again to see whats wrong.between carbs 1&2 and 3&4 there is a mechanism consisting of 2 springs and a screw.this is to be idle setting between the carbs and then you have a 3rd setting that synchronizes the two sets.I have found that the 3&4 screw with spring fell off and that meant that the butterflies were always slightly open.a)Is this the idle speed setting like I believe?b)And does that mean I need the special tool to synch them?

Thank you in advance

NC 23 starting problem

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