Diaphragm springs query

[Soupyzrx]

Hey hey,
The slippy clutch saga reaches its next chapter.
I bought a set of EBC diaphragm springs and they arrived this morning. Happy days? Well, maybe not.....
Now, my background in geometry tells me that these are just very shallow truncated cones and as such I would have expected them to fit neatly inside one another, with a regular fit round the circumference.
The ones that I got do sit inside one another, but there are gaps between them round the base circumference which can be increased or decreased by rotating one or two of them within the other one which suggests to me that one or more of them is bent.
Question is, is this normal for these diaphragm spings?
When I sit them individually on a flat surface, I can see that they are certainly not completely flat round the base. They are touching the surface in a few places, but there are definitely gaps elsewhere.
I thought they should sit completely flat, with the entire base in contact with the surface.
If that is the case, then these ones are warped or bent and the pain in my arse continues.
Can anyone shed any light on this please?
If this is normal, then fine I'll fit them and give it a try, but if not then I need to start complaining and get a replacement set.
My bike is determined to make me miss the decent weather, it would appear.
Cheers.

[vic-vtrvfr]

You're not having much luck chum.
Nearly tempted to pull the clutch outta my spare engine and lend it to you just so you can get on the road!

[Soupyzrx]

It's doin' my bleedin' head in, Vic.
The annoying thing now is not knowing. I dunno whether these springs are ok or not. They cetainly don't lie on a flat suface the way I expected. There'll be a gap between the spring and the surface of maybe a millimetre or so but when you push that bit down till it touches the surface, it opens a gap of 4-5mm at the other side!
They definitely seem to be warped, I just don't know if they're supposed to be, y'know?
I do appreciate your thought Vic, but the reason you have kept a spare is just in case you need it sometime. Lending it to someone else (especially me, with my 'lucky' track record) would only guarantee that the clutch in your bike would disintegrate immediately.
Cheers.

[speedy231278]

I may be mistaken, but I seem to recall that the set of genuine springs I got some years ago lay flat on one another. I've just dug the springs out of a spare clutch I have sat in the office (doesn't everyone?), and they lie perfectly on top of one another. No gaps anywhere. The top spring has some wear on the top edge in the centre where the operating rod comes through, but the other two are basically mint. Maybe the springs will sort themselves out once the clutch is installed, but I'd certainly be on to EBC asking if there's maybe been a fault in production!

[Soupyzrx]

I may be mistaken, but I seem to recall that the set of genuine springs I got some years ago lay flat on one another. I've just dug the springs out of a spare clutch I have sat in the office (doesn't everyone?), and they lie perfectly on top of one another. No gaps anywhere. The top spring has some wear on the top edge in the centre where the operating rod comes through, but the other two are basically mint. Maybe the springs will sort themselves out once the clutch is installed, but I'd certainly be on to EBC asking if there's maybe been a fault in production!

Ok, thanks boss. That's what I wanted to know, and because I'm stuck in work here, I wasn't going to have a chance to check out another set of springs until I get home this evening.
They should sit neatly together then...... I wonder how much it matters if they don't......

[Sunnyday]

buddy,

Don't fit them your clutch basket will not engage and disengage evenly that was my problem, have a read of your clutch related post what I have posted back.

Don't fit them.

[Soupyzrx]

Ah yes, right. Why do I not remember reading that before? Thank you.
So I'll be returning the EBC springs then, I guess.
They really are a mile off being flat, when laid on a flat surface.
I had almost decided to just take my chances and fit them and hope for the best, but I'm just being impatient.
I'll order a set of Honda springs and continue waiting.

[Soupyzrx]

Ok, I just phoned David Silver and they don't have any in stock and Honda have discontinued them, so where did you get your genuine Honda springs from Sunnyday?

[magg]

It appears to be a common theme in many posts on this forum that parts are replaced without reference to the manufacturer's specified service limits.

There is a copy of the Honda factory service manual on this site, that can provide all the info required to determine which parts are out of spec and the Haynes manual is an alternative but not always the best source of info. I prefer to start with the Honda service manual. Another document that can prove useful is the Honda General Service Manual that can be obtained on the www.

My point is, why not measure the parts in the clutch that would cause slippage due to wear and compare the results against Honda's specification. This should indicate which parts need replacing in order to repair the fault and perhaps save some money by not purchasing parts that are not required.

[Neosophist]

Ok, I just phoned David Silver and they don't have any in stock and Honda have discontinued them, so where did you get your genuine Honda springs from Sunnyday?

yes Honda clutch diaphram springs long discontinued, even nos is hard to find now.

It appears to be a common theme in many posts on this forum that parts are replaced without reference to the manufacturer's specified service limits.

There is a copy of the Honda factory service manual on this site, that can provide all the info required to determine which parts are out of spec and the Haynes manual is an alternative but not always the best source of info. I prefer to start with the Honda service manual. Another document that can prove useful is the Honda General Service Manual that can be obtained on the www.

My point is, why not measure the parts in the clutch that would cause slippage due to wear and compare the results against Honda's specification. This should indicate which parts need replacing in order to repair the fault and perhaps save some money by not purchasing parts that are not required.

this is good advice too, the service book in the downloads section has all the information on tolerances for parts, including those in the clutch.

Don't forget you have metal, friction and springs in there. one of the pitfalls of old bikes but you can probably make a decent set of clutch springs out of two old clutches if need be.