NC24 solenoid melted and shorting out .HELP!!!

[zzr1400]

Ok. The boys NC24 suddenly died while doing 65-70MPH(he says!!) on the way to a job interview ,No warning at all just died.When I went to sort it by the roadside ,The 1st thing I did was take off the R/H side panel to get to the main fuse and there was a lovely melted mess where the connector/fuse should have been .So slung it in the back of the van and ordered a new solenoid and 2nd hand wiring loom.I did not want to replace the whole harness so then spliced and soldered into the wiring the 2nd hand connector with 3" of wire using heat shrink tubing on each conductor and job done ,or so I thought.
I then connected the live to the battery and went to put the negative on and I have a short circuit somewhere as the negative wire just trys to weld onto the battery terminal with the ignition off.
With the connector removed the negative is fine when connected to the battery with ignition off.
I am a qualified electrician by trade BUT not on vehicle electrics.I do not know where to start as I have not got a wiring diagram .
Is a diagram available for the NC24 (1987)??? If so where and how can I get one?
The only other option is re-slice the solenoid connector onto the 2nd hand harness and change the complete harness over and hope the its the wiring thats got the short circuit and not any electronics etc thats gone kaput !!
ANY HELP PLEASE!!!!!
scoots

[magg]

Try disconnecting the rect/reg unit, it is a permanent connection to the battery outside the control of the ignition switch. It could have an internal short although the 30 amp fuse in the solenoid block should have provided protection for the loom.

[zzr1400]

Hi Magg.
I will try that tomorrow night when I get home from work,
Getting info for this bike is a nightmare unless anyone on here can help out !! thank goodness for forums .The 30 Amp fuse MAY not have protected the Reg /Rec as It was all so melted together that the fuse may not have had a chance to protect anything ,it was that heated up that all 5 wires were possiby touching together the fuse was also only half complete ,the rest melted outright.
Cheers for the info and I will let yuou know how things are after trying it tomorrow night.
I am quite capable (I think) of sorting it with help as I wrote a complete "How to wire additional extras" to the zzr1400 for the zx14r forum, for ALL possible extras inc autocom etc,HID`s, alarms,H/output horns via relays etc etc etc while recuperating from a major op over xmas.
Cheers
scoots

[magg]

Here is a wiring diagram, not the best picture I am afraid.

[zzr1400]

Magg
Your`e a star matey!!
As you say its not the best ,and my Japanese is not any good at all LOL BUT its a big help as at least I can see (just) what go`s where, I will have a go at it tonight.
Thanks
Pete

[zzr1400]

Well i have not had much time to look at the vfr,but have disconnected the reg/rec from the harness and it has made no difference at all.when connecting the battery it still acts like a welder. so it looks as though the wiring harness will have to be changed.Lets hope I get time to do it this weekend among all the other jobs that HAVE to be done as well.
scoots

[Neosophist]

From memory (+ i'm sleepy)

You have a good short to earth somewhere.

Sounds like your starter solenoid could be fried, it sits in a rubber boot usually, it's not earthing somewhere is it? It shouldn't matter but if it's fried you never know...

The battery Positive runs to the starter solenoid which the reg/rec connections to right.

This has 4 pins and the main 30amp fuse.

I'd start by looking at that.

Your battery positive lead isn't fraid and touching the frame anywhere is it?

if you remove the main 30 amp fuse from it you shouldn't get any shorts.. if you still do then it stands a chance that the solenoid is buggard (althuogh it neesd to be able to earth)

Sorry i'm not a lot of help on this one, difficult without seeing.

For me, i'd start by looking at the soleonid.. if I got nowhere with that, unplug all the connectors, theres only a handful and there mostly in the same place and go from there, firstly get it so you can connect the battery with the fuse and re-connect one by one looking for a blown fuse.

[zzr1400]

Hi Neo
It should not be the solenoid mate cause its a brand spanking new one(I know that do`s not mean its ok)TtHE PLAN THIS WEEKEND IS AS YOU SAY UNPLUG EACH CONNECTOR ONE AT A TIME AND SEE IF THIS SORTS IT,THEN AT LEAST i KNOW WHERE TO START LOOKING FOR THE DEAD SHORT TO EARTH(SORRY -vE)..Although I suspect its going to be melted or worn through the harness to -Ve somewhere.The state of the connector on top of the solenoid suggests to me melted conductors due to heat build up in the harness.
scoots

[Neosophist]

If it's sparking like an earth short with Ignition off then it narrows it down a lot as there isn't a lot of wiring thats permanalty live.. if the connector to the solenoid melted (i've seen them melt when they've just been dirty / loose, much like the reg/rec connector) it could have melted the wires in the harness like you say.

So in this case.. for whatever reason.. lets assume loose / dirty connector, it generates heat to overcome the extra reistance from shitty connection and melts.

This causes one of the wires in the harness to melt too and they short out.

Bike then dies.

Soo.. workign on this theory (bit more awake now)

Use your resistance test (ohms) on the multimeter, to make sure you don't have an open circuit (0 ohms) between the wires in the solenoid block connector.. if you do then strip the tape back off and find where they have melted together.

[zzr1400]

Well an update is needed here me thinks.
I have to admit defeat, after trying 3-4 times to sort this problem out.It will be going to a local dealer who do`s not rip me off !!!!
I have managed to get the lights/indies/horn working and the solenoid very faintly clicks when the starter is pressed and I seem to have got rid of the short circuit but the clutch diode is defiantly kaput so Im now at a loss and have given up.
I did find a couple of bad bodges which I have sorted,,joints on bullet connectors on the alternator wires (burnt badly) now soldered and heat shrink tubed up. etc etc ,Thanks for the help on this one though boys .
Its now more bloody money to fork out for him to have it back on the road !!!! KIDS !!!!!
scoots