weird charging problem ,found.....

[bikemonkey]

Check your battery voltage like magg has said, could be fudged battery and/or blown reg/rec.

[vfrman]

ok i did as you said and according to the chart my charging system is just fine, could it be that there was just a loose connection or something? i went for a drive right after charging the battery and it seems fine now

Hard to tell. Have you inpsected all the connectors? Any sign of overheating/melting? Give them a spray of WD-40. You could just have a battery on its way out.

[Neosophist]

ok i did as you said and according to the chart my charging system is just fine, could it be that there was just a loose connection or something? i went for a drive right after charging the battery and it seems fine now

Perhaps.

That reg/rec isnt stock anyway so the charging systems probably had faults before.

The solder quality looks utter shite.

Make sure the wires are clean and oxidise free else you wont get a good solder joint.

You said you get 0 volts from the stator, as I said in my previous post you need to recheck your settings, im not trying to say you measured it wrong but ive not seen a genny that doesnt output anything before. So I suspected your readings were wrong.

Did you have the multimeter set to AC volts?

Were you measuring the voltage with the yellow wires disconnected from the regulstor?_

Were you measuring the correct wires (i.e. the ones coming from the genny, NOT from the reg/rec)

[SilverSurfer]

hi guys i have good news it was the R/R and i didn`t have to buy one ,i found an old R/R from one of my old bikes.
and yes i know its not a 3 phase but it works.


and heres the wiring:

Black - 12VDC Monitoring wire (Connect to 12VDC feed to brake light or headlight)
Red - Battery (DC charging system wire)[directly to battery via a fuse]
Yellow - Stator (AC charging system wire)[ i connected it to 1 of the yellow on genny]
Green - Ground
Pink - Stator (AC charging system wire, typically white on the stator)[ i connected it to 1 of the yellow on genny]


* Monitoring wire checks the 12VDC system and raises or lowers 12V output based on the needs of your system so your battery doesnt overcharge or undercharge. This wire does not need to be hooked up but is recommended.

THANX again for your help guys , and btw the output from the R/R to the battery is corresponding with the test values you guys gave me.

[magg]

A single phase charging system is not going to work long term. The electrical system load, particularly the headlights are on, is such that eventually the battery will go flat. You will need to ride daytime only and long distances without meeting any traffic to have any chance of charging the battery. You need a three phase rect/reg.

[SilverSurfer]

I didn`t know that but if it at-least lasts 1 or 2 months it`s fine . By then i`ll have a 3 phase R/R and i do leave the lights of in daytime because i don`t want to put unnecessary strain on the R/R. i`m going to buy a r6 R/R because it`s also a 5 pin, any input on that? i want to know before i buy it

[Neosophist]

It seems a lot of the people on the board from S.Africa seem to like their bodge jobs. I would be more worried about it burning out your stator than burning out your reg/rec.

The genny is a 3 phase unit that can supply upto 350 watts of power for the bike.

Many people (I think Mark has a pic he loves to throw up of a burned out genny he had) have experienced a burned out genny, this is most often caused by the connector plug to the reg/rec becoming oxidised overtime and making a bad connection.

The genny has to put out more power than it normally would to overcome the crappy connection and it doesnt take long before the genny is overpowered and burns out.

Your asking the bike to supply the entire power to run the lights, charge the battery, ignition box, horn and everything else from just one phase of the generator now.

Each phase is roughly 120 watts (3 phase / 350).. This is only the same as two headlamps on full beam.

I think you might burn out a phase of the genny.

Then youll need a new genny and a new reg/rec.

[SilverSurfer]

ok... so basically your saying the head lamps will cause the genny to die? my headlamps are 18/18 each so hopefully by the time i get the new R/R the genny will still be fine i hope and i`m using a connector block between the genny and R/R so i think the connection is ok

[magg]

SilverSurfer I would be very surprised to find that your headlamps are 18/18 W each, 35/60 or 55/60 W are the std bulbs.

I beg to differ with Neosophist in that the stator will not be damaged by running a single phase rect/reg, you will simply get insufficient output to run the electrics, particularly if the headlights are ON.

No load on two phases means they have a free ride, lots of volts, no current. The working phase will generate volts, limited by the rect/reg, and current for the existing electrical load up to its max rated output. Then the voltage will start to fall and at this point the battery will have to take up the difference. The current provided by the battery will eventually cause the battery to go flat. With all three phases functioning the battery rarely has to provide a current and gets recharged even when it does and therefore does not go flat.

[Neosophist]

SilverSurfer I would be very surprised to find that your headlamps are 18/18 W each, 35/60 or 55/60 W are the std bulbs.

I beg to differ with Neosophist in that the stator will not be damaged by running a single phase rect/reg, you will simply get insufficient output to run the electrics, particularly if the headlights are ON.

No load on two phases means they have a free ride, lots of volts, no current. The working phase will generate volts, limited by the rect/reg, and current for the existing electrical load up to its max rated output. Then the voltage will start to fall and at this point the battery will have to take up the difference. The current provided by the battery will eventually cause the battery to go flat. With all three phases functioning the battery rarely has to provide a current and gets recharged even when it does and therefore does not go flat.

You seem to confuse current and voltage and the role of the main fuse in the system. The 30 amp fuse is not there specifically to protect against reg/rec failure.

You will find many posts, one just the otherday of somebody who had a reg/rec failure. The reg was outputting at 18v and was boiling away the battery. The bike was still running fine and the first thing the rider knew was when the battery had died from being overcharged.

My NC24 also suffered the same fate, 18v out the output.

You will have no doubt seen the endless amounts of threads on here with reg/rec / genny failure. The main fuse has done nothing to protect this.

As I said before the genny output is 360 watts.

Watts = Amps x Volts

This gives a maximum current of 30 amps at full load. Drawing anymore than this will risk an overload the alternator and the main fuse will blow.

This is why the main fuse is there. To stop a system overload. If you try to pull too much power from the generator it will get very hot, be unable to cool and melt itself to pieces.

You will see that the plug that connects the genny to the reg/rec often melts / sets on fire when the contacts become dull, this is becuase the generator is outputting too much power to overcome the resistance. If the contacts do not break when they are burning away it will eventually overheat the genny and cause it to burn (ask Mark for his famous genny picture)

3 phase stators have very thin wire, this is because the power is generated in 3 phases so the load is spread and the heat from the stator is disappated evenly a single phase isnt doing all the work all the time.

Now however you still have a 30 amp fuse to protect against overload but are only supplying power from one phase.

If we assume an even load of 120 watts per phase thats circa 10 amps maximum power per phase..

Don't forget that 3 phase isnt mono phase so the load will also be distributed, the reg/rec will be shunting when there is too much power (no load on the stator at this time) so it will normally have chance to cool down to some extent.

Now we are asking only one phase to do this work.

The working phase will generate volts, limited by the rect/reg, and current for the existing electrical load up to its max rated output.

The generator will try to supply as many amps as the system asks for (upto 30, which is when the main fuse will blow)

Asking this from a single phase is a bad idea. Everyone has seen what happens to a genny when the connector block corrodes and it melts itself away.

Sounds like a bad idea to me, even if you dont kill it you are asking one phase to do all the work continiously.