The Needle Thread

Forum rules
Please can you post items for sale or wanted in the correct For Sale section. Items / bikes for sale here will be removed without warning. Reasons for this are in the FAQ. Thanks
User avatar
superlite
Site Supporter
Site Supporter
Posts: 748
Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 11:52 pm
Bike owned: TLS, LB80 x 2
Location: Australia
Contact:

The Needle Thread

Post by superlite » Sun Apr 18, 2010 7:44 am

Not knitting related :grin:

So an old thread re-surfaced and reminded me of some needle work (ahem) that I was doing a while back. I've measured most of the carb needles available to suit NC30 carbs (HRC and OE). I've just re-discovered the data, so I'll slowly put it all together and post it here as I go. So in the end we should have a collection of profiles for all the different needles in one spot.

I know that personally, my needle choice comes down to seat of pants testing and what others are running. But if we know the needle profile and how that affects fuelling, we should be able make a more educated choice rather than guess with trial and error (i.e. turn these measurements into something qualitative). Calling all tech heads :ugeek:

So to kick off, here's a comparison of one of the standard NC30 needles (J51B) and a HRC SS needle (8ZF). There is only a very slight difference in base diameter between the two. There is an obvious difference in length. But the key difference is in the tapers - 8ZF will run noticibly richer than the stock needle.

Image
Last edited by superlite on Tue Apr 20, 2010 9:45 am, edited 2 times in total.
'Take it to the Back'

User avatar
Cammo
Site Supporter
Site Supporter
Posts: 4505
Joined: Thu May 01, 2008 12:35 am
Bike owned: NC30
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: The Needle Thread

Post by Cammo » Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:40 am

That means more to me than seeing individual measurements, very nice! :worthy:

Let's see all the needle measurements on a single graph!?

I'd be very interested to see how the nc21/24 needles compare to the hrc items.


:popcorn:
"It's just a ride" Bill Hicks

User avatar
superlite
Site Supporter
Site Supporter
Posts: 748
Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 11:52 pm
Bike owned: TLS, LB80 x 2
Location: Australia
Contact:

Re: The Needle Thread

Post by superlite » Sun Apr 18, 2010 8:47 am

DataRacer wrote: Let's see all the needle measurements on a single graph!? :popcorn:
Whoa, slow down turbo! It took two years to get the first graph up :whistle:

That is the plan though.
'Take it to the Back'

Neosophist
Moderators
Moderators
Posts: 8172
Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2008 1:01 pm
Bike owned: CBR954

Re: The Needle Thread

Post by Neosophist » Sun Apr 18, 2010 11:08 am

Coming soon in 2012 :whistle: :grin:
xivlia wrote:i dont go fast on this bike so really do not need a rear brake.. /
vic-vtrvfr wrote:Ask xivlia for help, he's tackled just about every problem u could think of...

User avatar
CRM
Admin NWAA
Admin NWAA
Posts: 2972
Joined: Sat Apr 05, 2008 2:06 pm
Location: NorthWest
Contact:

Re: The Needle Thread

Post by CRM » Sun Apr 18, 2010 12:30 pm

lol i am gonna keep a beady on this. i have some needles i dont mind sharing :o
i will go have a rummage see what i have
Insert Signature Here

User avatar
superlite
Site Supporter
Site Supporter
Posts: 748
Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 11:52 pm
Bike owned: TLS, LB80 x 2
Location: Australia
Contact:

Re: The Needle Thread

Post by superlite » Tue Apr 20, 2010 9:56 am

For those that are wondering, I won't be comparing the J51A and J51B stock NC30 needles with each other. J51B is 0.1 mm longer than J51A - aside from that, they're identical. They are a good reference for other needles though.

Here's another one: Stock NC21 8ZC plotted against the NC30 HRC SS 8ZF. Identical length, slightly different profile and a significant difference in diameter where it counts. Perhaps a good (and cheap) upgrade for a road bike with mild mods though?

Image

Some slightly more exotic needles coming soon............
'Take it to the Back'

User avatar
Cammo
Site Supporter
Site Supporter
Posts: 4505
Joined: Thu May 01, 2008 12:35 am
Bike owned: NC30
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: The Needle Thread

Post by Cammo » Tue Apr 20, 2010 10:00 am

Nice. :up:

Can we see J51# vs NC21 8ZC? Obviously there's a length difference, but would like to see if there's any other difference.

How many measurements are you taking of each needle diameter to get these graphs?
"It's just a ride" Bill Hicks

Old Painless
Familiar Member
Posts: 295
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 1:15 pm

Re: The Needle Thread

Post by Old Painless » Tue Apr 20, 2010 10:01 am

Why does the graph start at 6mm wide ?

User avatar
superlite
Site Supporter
Site Supporter
Posts: 748
Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 11:52 pm
Bike owned: TLS, LB80 x 2
Location: Australia
Contact:

Re: The Needle Thread

Post by superlite » Tue Apr 20, 2010 10:21 am

Old Painless wrote:Why does the graph start at 6mm wide ?
I'm still getting to grips with the way I stored the data 2 years ago! I think the idea early on was to graph the entire profile, i.e. both sides of the needle.

EDIT: The graphs are not meant to visually represent the needle (symmetrically), but rather the actual diameter of each of the needle sections. I could display them as visual profiles. i.e. both sides of the needle, but it wouldn't mean much as the vertical axis would be displayed in positive and negative values and require doubling to extract the real values :?
Last edited by superlite on Tue Apr 20, 2010 11:18 am, edited 1 time in total.
'Take it to the Back'

User avatar
CMSMJ1
Moderators
Moderators
Posts: 7152
Joined: Thu May 01, 2008 9:42 am
Bike owned: NC30-No9
Location: Chesterfield, United Kingdom

Re: The Needle Thread

Post by CMSMJ1 » Tue Apr 20, 2010 10:26 am

great thread. can we sticky it please mods?
IMPERATOR REX ANGLORUM

The V4 is the law..

NC30 - No9 - my old mate

Post Reply