Help! NC35 not firing on front 2 cylinders

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Neosophist
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Re: Help! NC35 not firing on front 2 cylinders

Post by Neosophist » Sat Jul 11, 2015 5:12 am

sjparker wrote:Ok so took the bike into an independant mechanic for diagnostics this is what he's come back with:

"One coil pack has packed up the other one has a very weak spark also the sparking unit has burnt out. sparking unit is £272+ the VAT, coils are £124+ VAT each"

Should I go with the genuine parts or is there anywhere else to pick them up slightly cheaper?

Thanks in advance all!
Stop, first do not do anything yet.

I think its a very bad idea to take it to these dealers. You need to take it to an old bike specialist if you want the best service, or learn to do thing yourself. That diagnositc sounds like it could be sort of correct (not common at all but lets go into that)

Coils are indeed 125+ vat but they rarely fail, you can test them yourself following the service book on the website. A far more common fault is bad connection to the coils / faulty leads.

Many times people have replaced coils to fix the problem when the real problem was a poor connection and plug leads which were fixed as a byproduct of changing the coil, cleaning up the connections would have allowed the old coil to work fine.

If your coil(s) have actually failed id put a cheap second hand one in there, they rarely go wrong. I'd want to re-test the coils myself according to the book to be sure they have gone.

Sparking unit is parts book took for ignition box. If this has burnt out then how are you getting any sparks? It could be kind of faulty but unless they have already swapped it for a known good one to confirm then how are they provding the igntiion box is faulty?

Which leads me onto the next point. The ignition box does not just burn out.. overvoltage will kill it which is a classic sign of faulty charging system.

If the ignition box is burned out id want a full test of the charging system done ortherwise you could just replace all these parts to burn them out again.

It really depends on how the garage has proved all the parts are faulty, if done methodically it looks like a charging overload has burned the stuff out (common on this bike) so that is something you also need checking / fixing if faulty.. but then again this kind of thing can be caused by poor connection / low battery so could also be stabbing in the dark.

Not wanting to slag anyone off without knowing their process but you can easily confirm all of their diagnosis by yourself with the shop maunal and a multimeter..

The sparkunit aka cdi is long discontinued now so i dont know how they are giving you a price on that as you cannot buy them new anymore.... that is a bit suspicious

If the ignition box is fried your best bet is probably to fit an ignitech unit (its programmable which if a bonus if you want to fiddle with the bike but it also works as a standard box should you not wnat to fiddle, and its available to buy and its cheaper than the non existant stock)

I would even replace the coils until id tested them and proved they are no good.
xivlia wrote:i dont go fast on this bike so really do not need a rear brake.. /
vic-vtrvfr wrote:Ask xivlia for help, he's tackled just about every problem u could think of...

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Re: Help! NC35 not firing on front 2 cylinders

Post by magg » Sat Jul 11, 2015 7:09 am

+1 for neo. Also a faulty charging system can cause ignition system problems, insufficient or too much voltage confuses the ignition control unit. If checking the igntion coil resistances does not identify a problem, disconnect the rect/reg and jumper the battery with a known good spare and start the engine. If it runs ok then you have a charging system issue. Should the ignition unit still appear suspect, you could examine the ignition unit for failure of the internal over-voltage protection device. Even if the ignition unit is suffering from over-voltage, it may be repairable.

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Re: Help! NC35 not firing on front 2 cylinders

Post by sjparker » Mon Jul 13, 2015 9:39 am

Neosophist, Magg - Thanks so much for the replies.

Does anyone know a reputable mechanic for these 400s in the Hampshire area? I'm forwarding a version of this thread to the mechanic I'm working with to check all these things out, but in the future I'd look for a reliable 400 specialist reasonably local to Southampton.

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speedy231278
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Re: Help! NC35 not firing on front 2 cylinders

Post by speedy231278 » Mon Jul 13, 2015 11:47 am

vfrman wrote:WTH is a sparking unit?
I presume it's a reference, albeit slightly inaccurate, to the ignition.
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Re: Help! NC35 not firing on front 2 cylinders

Post by Neosophist » Mon Jul 13, 2015 3:00 pm

speedy231278 wrote:
vfrman wrote:WTH is a sparking unit?
I presume it's a reference, albeit slightly inaccurate, to the ignition.
As above it's from the parts book " 30410MR8901 Spark unit" commonly known on here as ignition box / TCI etc.

But above I was wrong about spark unit being unavaiable, I was looking at the NC30 part which is long discontinued, you can still get the RVF ignition box new for about 280 quid but I wouldnt do that.
xivlia wrote:i dont go fast on this bike so really do not need a rear brake.. /
vic-vtrvfr wrote:Ask xivlia for help, he's tackled just about every problem u could think of...

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Re: Help! NC35 not firing on front 2 cylinders

Post by speedy231278 » Mon Jul 13, 2015 4:38 pm

I was wondering if it is a hangover from the days of a CDI where the ignition box would produce the ooomph to create the spark at the plug, rather than trigger a coil pack to do the same?

And you are right about not buying a new one for about £300, you can usually find used ones on eBay for probably a tenth of the price. I paid £18 for one last year!
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