VFR400 is now a v-twin.... ergggH!

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DAmnthisNC30love
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VFR400 is now a v-twin.... ergggH!

Post by DAmnthisNC30love » Fri Aug 05, 2011 1:51 pm

Hey all...been looking around the site for ideas and have tried most if not all of them and even some of my own but to no avail.

Brief history on bike.
Bought 89 NC30 about 5-6 years ago for my girlfriend at the time. She loved it but after a week or so of riding it, had dramas getting it started. Looking back on it, it was probably just poor starting technique and some bad plugs but at that time i was more interested playing with my own bikes so looking at hers took a back seat. I eventually stripped it down to check the carbs and clean them out and inspect plugs which were all ok suprisingly. Buuuut no go. I persisted though and eventually managed to get it running well enough for a short 10 minute ride before it started coughing and spluttering. I got it home and then had issues getting it restarted so the carbs came off again. This roundabout circus went on for a few weeks and I gave up. My gf took the bike back and said she'd take it to a garage to get fixed but that never happened and it stayed in her garage for a few years...we broke up and i thought nothing else of it.

I spoke to her recently though and the bike was still in her posession so with my race season underway (race an Sv650) and it running perfectly I was in need of something to tinker with.

I picked up the NC30 and got right into it.
Carbs stripped and cleaned. Jets etc checked, float checked and set to specs.
New float bowl gaskets
New inlet boots and clamps
New plugs
New Fuel (checked fuel tap)
New Battery
tried to start and although it would turn over...no run time.
Can of 'Start-ya-Bastard' and got it to go :)
It idled for a short time and then died.
Carbs off...checked over...reinstallted.....tried again
(did this a few times)
Bike would then idle ok at 1200rpm but die as soon as throttle applied after warm up.
Suspected poor fittment of carbs and sure enough spraying above mentioned start ya bastard on inlet boots found that the front left cylinder must have a small leak as revs increased when sprayed. Figured just a lean problem so carbs off again, swapped boots around, rechecked to make sure in right spot, put carbs back on....SAME problem. (I also checked to make sure there was spark from each plug and all ok)

All sounds pretty standard so far huh?! here's the kicker.

Last night I try and start it up...have to use trusty starting fluid and idles away ok...I'm not sure why but i thought I'd touch the headers to see if all cylinders were firing and guess what?! BUH Boowwwwwww!! front right not firing!..checked the others and found that rear right was also not firing so my little VFR400 was now a VFR200 and not loving life!

Being that its not front or rear cylinders firing I knew that it wasnt the limp mode issue (have since performed mods to ensure this isnt an issue in the future) so I suspected the coils. Haynes manual at the ready the coils are in spec. Reg/Rec is also in spec so I moved on to the pulse generator pickups/triggers and the resistance is lower than suggested in the manual 412ohms compared to 450-500ohms @ 20degrees as listed in manual. Butttt my garage is cold'ish and both pickups have same resistance so maybe its just my mutimeter? Im going to test another one tomorrow.

I have a spare motor to take parts from and I performed the same test as above and found the resistance to be ~420ohms on each pickup so either I have two sets of pickups that are screwed (possible) or a dodge mutimeter (also possible)

Question is....would this likely explain the bike not running on all four cylinders or could it still be me doing something screwy with carb settings (should mention I now have three sets of carbs which I've tried and all have same issue/s)...yes we know 1 cylinder is a bit lean due to leak but that wouldnt stop other cylinders firing would it?

Arghh....love the VFR but thank god I race the SV...soooo much simpler!!! :P

Ideas people...throw em at me! PLEEEEEEEEASE!

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hannakournikova
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VFR400 is now a v-twin.... ergggH!

Post by hannakournikova » Fri Aug 05, 2011 2:21 pm

I had the same problem.
Fitted new carb rubbers and tightened everything down and all worked 100% after :)

Alex_ludd
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Re: VFR400 is now a v-twin.... ergggH!

Post by Alex_ludd » Fri Aug 05, 2011 2:25 pm

Welcome to the forum

Have you checked the plugs are sparking

Also i would compression test the cylinders just for peace of mind

and make sure everything is nice and tight :grin:

Neosophist
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Re: VFR400 is now a v-twin.... ergggH!

Post by Neosophist » Fri Aug 05, 2011 2:31 pm

hannakournikova wrote:I had the same problem.
Fitted new carb rubbers and tightened everything down and all worked 100% after :)
Hmm..

Firstly, with the bike running spray SYB into the trumpets of the carbs not firing, do the revs improve? If so this suggests a fuelling problem with the carbs.

Are the two not firing cylinders fed by the same coil? If so swap the coils over and see if you get the opposite result (faulty coil)

If not swap the plugs over (faulty plugs if symptoms reversed)

If still not faulty ECU or pickup are a possibility.

Are valve shims (clearnaces) within spec?

Check and reset if necessary.. a compression test if there in spec.

If they have lower compression try a couple of tea-spoons of oil down the plug hole.. if it improves worn rings. if not broken valves are likely
xivlia wrote:i dont go fast on this bike so really do not need a rear brake.. /
vic-vtrvfr wrote:Ask xivlia for help, he's tackled just about every problem u could think of...

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Cammo
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Re: VFR400 is now a v-twin.... ergggH!

Post by Cammo » Sat Aug 06, 2011 12:42 am

Check that the screws under the rubber intake boots (for fitting vacuum gauges to balance carbs) are not leaking. Long shot...

Try new plugs also (or just swap a couple around to see if it helps). They foul very easily, especially when you're spraying stuff down the carbs.
"It's just a ride" Bill Hicks

DAmnthisNC30love
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Re: VFR400 is now a v-twin.... ergggH!

Post by DAmnthisNC30love » Sat Aug 06, 2011 1:41 am

Cammo
-rubbers are new and have been inspected and all are ok. I have swapped them about to see if I could get the leak to move to another cylinder and no go. I've checked the balancing screws but will do so again.
I've just put new plugs in but haven't attempted to swap them from side to side so that's something to try.

Neosophist
I haven't tried spraying the trumpets once bike is idling as I've been making sure the bike starts and idles with airbox in place. Not a bad idea to give that a go though to determine the fueling issue possibility.. Thanks
The two that aren't firing are coming from seperate coils..that led me to test the coils and HT leads and all are ok, I have a spare set of coils and leads from the spare engine so I could try that I guess but doubt thats it since i've seen spark from all four plugs.
Have spare CDI but as the spares are all coming from an engine I know nothing about and haven't seen running (was told it did .... :/ )then I'd have to find a donor one and their aren't that many VFR's here in Perth, W.Australia..
Valve shims and compression test are next on the list of things to do...hmmm hadn't considered busted valves...could explain it but wouldnt I hear it/them at idle when the other two cylinders are forcing them to move?


Alex_ludd
Yuh have checked spark plugs and all fire

hannakournikova
Really?....*sigh* I'm pretty sure I've mastered the art of getting the carbs on and off now. After fitting them and checking they are seated correctly they're all in where they should be...the only leak i've found is on the front left cylinder which happens regardless of what rubber boot I use so a)i'm not actually as good as I think I am at fitting them b) the balancing screw is somehow letting air in c) mystery cause...


Thanks for the suggestions...will head out to the garage now and see what I can come up with

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